It's time to stop unbanning people

~This topic is similar to serin1's thread, but is not the same~

What to do with unbanning:

At the moment on Swaggercraft, there is a growing number of members using hacked clients and illegal mods. These people get caught eventually, but the problem is not over. The REAL problem that Swaggercraft has with hackers is that fact that EVERY SINGLE hacker who makes an appeal gets unbanned.

Laser, I know that you like to give people a second chance and all, but I think unbanning obvious hackers with vclip, forcefield and combat hacks is simply not an option anymore. If you would look at the ban appeals, pretty much everyone gets unbanned, no matter the what the offense was. Honestly, I'm really sick of seeing players who have been banned multiple times for hacking, and all you do is unban them in 3 days and tell them to "Never use hacks again"

But guess what? I'll tell you a fun fact, laser: A vast majority of those people getting unbanned continue using nodus or whatever client they use. They NEVER EVER stop hacking, it just doesn't work that way. I pick on people, but I have to give examples on what I mean.

11thhero: So his first ban was using an autoclicker. Ok, that's not a big deal, unban in 7 days. I'm fine with that. But what DOES tick me off is that 11thhero says: "I promise i will never do anything like this again". Guess what? A few weeks later, this kid is caught sprinting backwards, while using major forcefield. What happened to him going clean? What was the point in unbanning him if he would continue using Nodus? Oh yeah, and here comes the kicker: The kid gets banned for the second time for using Nodus, and Laser UNBANS HIM!

So really, where is the logic in unbanning hackers? I don't see it. Same thing happens with qpthebossqp, hawkkiller and many other well known Nodus users, they get unbanned every single time they appeal.

Ban Appeals


What a Ban Appeal is:
A ban appeal is what a user would use to get unbanned. The purpose of this, is to argue about an unfair ban.

What a Ban Appeal is on Swaggercraft:
On Swaggercraft, a ban appeal can be used 3 times or more to get automatically unbanned. It does not matter how much proof there is, the person could world edit the spawn out and still get unbanned by posting an appeal. You can post a screenshot of yourself using Nodus (Chococyclops) and still get unbanned just for saying sorry. Even though the rules say that duping is a permaban, you can still make an appeal to get unbanned even though the owner of the server is 100% sure that you duped. Plus, you can always DDoS the server for a quick unban.

So again, with the unbans. Ban appeals are NOT tickets to get unbanned. If there is solid evidence that you hack, then you're banned for good. No appeal, no tempban. Just a solid permaban. Because as I said earlier, the person won't take of their Nodus.

Half the server hacks.

This is proabably true. Half of the server has hacked or is hacking at some point. And you know what? It's because Laser, you keep unbanning people.

For example, Player A is flying around spawn, and is the only hacker known to Swaggercraft. Player A gets banned, and appeals. He gets unbanned. Soon, Player A starts flying around in PvP AGAIN and gets unbanned. Player B sees this and gets the idea that you can hack all you want on this server and not get in major trouble. Soon, this trend goes on and it turns out that half the server is afraid of a ban.

So why is everyone on this server hacking? Because everyone knows that you can get unbanned for anything.

Donating for an unban

The current system of donating for an unban is bullshit. You literally get away with anything as long as you donate $5.
And in a way, you're getting REWARDED for hacking. So pretty much, you can forcefield while derping all you want, donate $30 for Swag and get unbanned. So what just happened? You just got a donor rank AND you got the ability to hack for one day without a ban. Amazing.

The new system for paying to get unbanned should go like this:
-You pay $15 to get unbanned
-You do NOT get a donor rank in the package
-If you had a previous donor rank, it gets reset to [Member]
-Your inventory, money and mcmmo stats should be reset
-Basically, it would be like joining the server for the very first time

I know this might seem harsh, but that's what you get for breaking the rules. I understand that people have donated money for items, stats and a rank, but it's their responsibility to take care of that. If you don't think you cant control your passion for Nodus, don't play on this server. A donor rank should never ever be an excuse to get unbanned. If you want to hack, it's your choice. Understand that you can lose everything you've paid for if you get caught hacking. Your money, your choice.

Laser, I'm sorry to pick on your habit in unbans, but it has to stop. This can't go on forever until almost everyone is using Nodus. I understand that you need funds to keep the server up and running, but a donor should not have a special "hacking permit" included with their package.

I would like to end this thread off by giving you guys a quote:
When minedudej was caught sprint hacking, forcefielding and flying all at the same time, this is what he said:

"It doesn't matter if I get banned, Laser would just unban me in 3 days"

God, this need to be taken into consideration. Anyone can hack on this server only to get a tempban. Even people who haven't donated get 3 or 4 'chances' on this server before getting perma-banned. Even after a month or so they'll still eventually get unbanned by simply saying 'I promise I won't do it again!' It's great that LaserLag gives second chances and all, but it kinda goes out of hand when hackers can hack without a worry in the world.

Agreed with all of the above. Hacking has gotten a lot worse since when I first joined. Laser and Mash really need to buckle down and be more strict on hackers, or it's going to get worse and worse from here. I think I've even said something along these lines at one point, "If I didn't have a conscience I'd figure, why not hack? Everyone else does and gets unbanned in like, 3 days or a week. Whom constantly get unbanned."

It's getting ridiculous. Every single person I've gotten banned for very obvious forcefeild are already unbanned. It's almost to the point of, why record? Why does getting them banned matter? When they're committing serious offenses and get a slight slap on the hands and a "Stoppppitt!!" Sorry, but that's not really 'teaching' them anything except that they can continuously get away with things with little punishment.

It's really been bugging, not only me, but plenty of other people. It's getting hard to enjoy Swagger with all the hackers, and to the point where I don't really like PvP that much anymore. I don't really like pulling this card but sometimes I debate leaving Swagger for a server more strict on bans.

This isn't this first time has been brought up, and it probably won't be the last.

No matter how many hackers we have on the server, topics like this will pop up on the forums; whether it be one hacker, or twenty. In that respect, no amount of banning is going to change your position on this.

We're going to be setting up a three-strikes system in 1.3. I agree with you that our current system is far too lenient, and people are getting off the hook far too often. However, people deserve a second chance. I'm willing to give them two.

The only way we're ever going to you guys happy is to ban every last person who hacks. Do you know what that would do to the server? It'd be BarrenCraft. Before we can just go swinging gung-ho at every suspected hacker, we need to get some new faces in here. Hopefully, updating to 1.3 will do just that.

Finally, and I can't stress this point enough to you guys... the majority of the people who have used hacks on this server... have never been caught. No matter what kind of banning policies we install, we cannot do anything about the hackers that are smart enough to slip under the radar.

P.S. - For the record, there is no way to buy yourself an unban. There have been plenty of people who have gotten banned, donated, and ended up not getting unbanned. That's why we tell people not to donate when they're banned.

Also, if AntiCheat is updated to the point of not having any severe malfunctions, we may be switching to that instead of NoCheat.

I think that everyone deserves a second chance but if they are caught hacking only by video or laser/mash seeing then that they should have their mcmmo reset to 0 like toxic said

Mash, I'm not asking for Laser and you to ban every single hacker. What I do want is a permaban for the hackers that have solid evidence against them. For example, if there's a video of you obviously forcefield and sprint hacking, it should be a permaban.

When you mention the server losing players, it won't. I'm sure a lot of new players are leaving this server because of the amount of hackers playing. Plus, whenever you encounter a new player and you kill them, they end up calling hacks on you. Why do they call hacks? Most likely because of previous experience with forcefielders or sprint hackers on this server.

We're never going to have a system of permabanning anyone who's been caught using hacks.

The first two bans will be their warning. After that, it's bon voyage. If you can't get three solid videos of somebody using hacks, then obviously the problem isn't very prevalent.

And honestly, the three strikes system will probably apply to all bans, not just hack-related ones.

Well the way the 3 strike system is set up, you're pretty much unbanning someone who will be hacking in the future. Do you really think that someone will Nodus will just give up on it? The reason people use it is to either troll people or have a massive advantage over people. I think the punishment should be more severe than just a ban for the first time. Maybe your rank gets dropped down by 1 for every ban. That will make people think before they hack. The system needs to be set up so people are actually scared of getting banned. Getting unbanned instantly an appeal is put up is not very punishing.

People have stopped using hacks in the past. I've seen players reform. It doesn't happen often, but it happens every now and then. I'm personally not interested in exiling players over something that could be a simple misunderstanding or mistake, on their part or ours.

If they're unwilling to listen to the warnings, then they're a lost cause, and they will receive a ban.

Should we start permanently muting people because they spammed once? I mean, obviously they did it once. It's simply not possible that they could actually stop because we told them to.

I would really like to have it a 2 strike system, it's dandy to have 3 as that just looks good with the strike system but hacking once=ban then appeal and get unbanned and if they hack again it goes against the trust we had in you giving up your hacks. Find an alt and if we don't catch it have fun on Swagger again.

I think for smaller offenses, a 3 strike system is fine. Such as spamming, sprint toggle, inventory tweaks, auto-equip, etc. But for serious offenses like v-clipping and combat hacks, I think that should be a 2 strike system. I don't think anyone should be permabanned forever on the first offense unless they're duping.

But I think 3 strikes is too many for serious offenses, because the extra strike reads as "Oh, you can still hack one more time, but no more after that!" For serious offenses, you should only have one chance to mess up. If you continue and are caught again, I'd say permaban.

Side thought:

I'm kinda iffy on the buy-to-unban thing. I like the idea of having them start out completely new, but if this were to be implanted I'd say you should only be able to purchase an unban once.

The problem with a 3 strike system is that, well - it's too easy to abuse.

Imagine you're safe, no strikes, so you decide to hack, as you know you'll be unbanned. And then they can repeat this for a second time, still going to be unbanned. People won't take the first two offences seriously.

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I think it should be a permanent ban on anything with 100% solid evidence. The only time anyone would be unbanned would be when it was a mistake on our behalf or something extremely minor such as accidentally using inventory tweaks when someone is about to attack you...

No 'temp' ban, there really is no point in it. Being banned for 1 week isn't going to stop someone from hacking. Permanent would mean less worry for staff, and more worry for the hackers, which would prevent quite a few from hacking. If there is an honest mistake, a moderator banning for glitch violations people would have a second chance due to the fact that they most likely were legit.


Also I don't understand why people think if you donate you get unbanned... I've seen plenty of donators permanently banned, and I've seen Laser reject a few people who tweeted that they'd donate if they got unbanned.


Edit: You could do what some large servers do. They still manage to keep a large player base.
Donate $10 to get unbanned, if they were hacking. If it was a mistake they create an appeal (not an apology).

A catch: If a player chooses to appeal they MUST be telling the truth. If their reason why they think they got unbanned is a lie/etc they no longer have the option to donate to get unbanned.

Although to add on, if somebody is caught hacking for a second time after buying an appeal, it's permanent - no way to get unbanned. This would prevent rich players from just unbanning themselves constantly and still get an edge.

ShaunDepro wrote:

Edit: You could do what some large servers do. They still manage to keep a large player base.
Donate $10 to get unbanned, if they were hacking. If it was a mistake they create an appeal (not an apology).

A catch: If a player chooses to appeal they MUST be telling the truth. If their reason why they think they got unbanned is a lie/etc they no longer have the option to donate to get unbanned.

Although to add on, if somebody is caught hacking for a second time after buying an appeal, it's permanent - no way to get unbanned. This would prevent rich players from just unbanning themselves constantly and still get an edge.

We (a couple members of Evolve) used to go on the Killion jail server and they do the 10 dollar unbanning. Also they deny EVERY SINGLE appeal. Period. The only way to get unbanned is to have 10 minutes of video leading up to your ban.


I guess if we did change things it would just depend on how strict we wanted to be.