Evolve's base drama stuffs..

Biionic wrote:

You don't know that he did, either. So it's not safe to assume that either. I know it's s safer bet, and makes more sense that this would be the cause. But why can't anyone look into this more than assuming? And since this was now publicly posted that Niner had Rocket's login files it's safe to say anyone involved is now just going to blame him rather than get the truth out. :/

I don't know about the password stealer client very much. I know someone on Swagger has it, and some passwords it can't steal for some reason. That's all I know. I can't answer your questions on that. But it does exist.

Some people are derps and dont even know that some hacked clients do have lastlogin stealers. So that can be an issue as well.

Guys, I really don't want to be the guy pointing fingers here, but I don't have a lot to go on.

Let me tell you all what I know.

I know that Rocket handed his account information to Niner.
I know that someone hacked Rocket's account afterwards.
I know that the IP we banned was probably a proxy.

Unless you guys have any REAL evidence that points towards something completely unrelated to the handing out of that sensitive information, then that's all I've got. The only person remotely connected to this incident so far to my understanding is Niner.

I don't believe that Rocket just HAPPENED to get hacked right after handing out his information.

I don't believe that a hacker would prefer to hack Rocket over myself or Laser if he were truly able to pluck information out of the sky.

So you guys need to give me something that I can believe, here.

Also, guys, you have to understand something.

Hackers do not hack someone once, and then wait for months and months to do it again. These hacking incidents are few and far between. Weeks of time pass before the next one occurs.

If there were truly someone who could get information (Let's even assume that they can't get mine or Laser's for whatever magical reason), they would not wait that long. Every member of every powerful faction would get hacked on a daily basis.

They would not wait this long to hack you.

I feel like this whole conversation should have been held privately and not publicly.
But since the worse has already come out I guess...

You can't just see one side of something and judge on it. Your job as Admin is a lot like a judge, you need to find out our side too, and investigate that. What if instead of finding out Rocket gave his .jar first, but instead you first find someone on the other side had that client? Whose side would you be on, and would you look at the other side after that? There is important information missing obviously. I know why you're assuming it's him, because it seems so obvious. But what if there's hidden information along the line that doesn't make it seem so obvious anymore?


EDIT:

Damn just got hacked and "raided" like, this past week or something. I don't know all the information on that though, or how accurate this statement is. But I know we're not the only ones. Someone changed SSB's /f home without them doing it to this past week.

Howdy folks!

ShepherdBook - Professional programmer and modder of Minecraft (the two are not related)

I have no statement regarding anything LL / Mash should do - its their house and they run it well enough without our interference.

About the possibilities of malicious code:
- It is not possible for a client that I am personally running to somehow steal the credentials from the client, say, Mash is running. The clients themselves do not interact with each other in any fashion.

- It is not only possible (but, I think, likely) to have a client that will store your login/password off when you login and will transmit that to a server for storage. Think of some of the cheat minecraft clients and how there always appears to be a storm of account logins/passwords available to run ddos. Have to come from somewhere and only a portion of these come from someone bruteforcing minecraft login servers. So - if you are running a client that someone gave you (or you downloaded from a known hack website) or you have EVER done such, it would be a good idea to not do that, to change your password, and to stop trusting people. Game modifications to minecraft right now have full access rights to everything you could do yourself - including the textbox controls that contain your login credentials when you type them in.

Did that happen here? Eh - my guess is that giving out your minecraft folder (if that happened) was probably the culprit but the paranoid me needs to ask a question. Have you ever used any client (hack or not) from a party besides mojang? IE - Ever run nodus or something similar? Ever run "this cool client" from random person? You still using the same login/pasword as you did back then? Yeah, I would fix that.

Apparently from what it looks like, Im getting banned because rocket gave me his .minecraft! Wow -______-

Biionic wrote:

I feel like this whole conversation should have been held privately and not publicly.
But since the worse has already come out I guess...

You can't just see one side of something and judge on it. Your job as Admin is a lot like a judge, you need to find out our side too, and investigate that. What if instead of finding out Rocket gave his .jar first, but instead you first find someone on the other side had that client? Whose side would you be on, and would you look at the other side after that? There is important information missing obviously. I know why you're assuming it's him, because it seems so obvious. But what if there's hidden information along the line that doesn't make it seem so obvious anymore?

It probably should have, but there's nothing we can do about it now. All we can do is keep personal information out of it.

Frankly, I have said time and time again that no client like that exists. They cannot just spoof IDs, or else everybody would be getting hacked every day. It simply cannot, and does not work like that.

There may be a client that can help get personal information, but since your information is stored on your computer, it would require you to download something first.

I haven't been presented with any information that even remotely suggests that this was done through some other means. Before I can stop assuming it was the handing out of that information to Niner that caused this, I need to be presented with any contradicting evidence.

And Niner, I'm not banning you.

A) I have no proof that you did anything with the information.
B) Even if I did, you did nothing wrong. You were literally invited into his account.

ShepherdBook wrote:

Howdy folks!

ShepherdBook - Professional programmer and modder of Minecraft (the two are not related)

I have no statement regarding anything LL / Mash should do - its their house and they run it well enough without our interference.

About the possibilities of malicious code:
- It is not possible for a client that I am personally running to somehow steal the credentials from the client, say, Mash is running. The clients themselves do not interact with each other in any fashion.

- It is not only possible (but, I think, likely) to have a client that will store your login/password off when you login and will transmit that to a server for storage. Think of some of the cheat minecraft clients and how there always appears to be a storm of account logins/passwords available to run ddos. Have to come from somewhere and only a portion of these come from someone bruteforcing minecraft login servers. So - if you are running a client that someone gave you (or you downloaded from a known hack website) or you have EVER done such, it would be a good idea to not do that, to change your password, and to stop trusting people. Game modifications to minecraft right now have full access rights to everything you could do yourself - including the textbox controls that contain your login credentials when you type them in.

Did that happen here? Eh - my guess is that giving out your minecraft folder (if that happened) was probably the culprit but the paranoid me needs to ask a question. Have you ever used any client (hack or not) from a party besides mojang? IE - Ever run nodus or something similar? Ever run "this cool client" from random person? You still using the same login/pasword as you did back then? Yeah, I would fix that.

Shepherdbook is right but i don't think that rocketeer has nodus or a hack. Either way shepherd now ALOT about minecraft and computers so he might now the answer to this.

I heard about the /f home setting. Me and Laser have discussed it thoroughly.

Unless someone got access to our server files, which we know they didn't, then it is impossible for someone to set the home of a faction without being in it.

It is not possible to do it from outside the faction. Sorry.

Again, guys, I want to make it abundantly clear how impossible it is for someone to be stealing your information from your default Minecraft client.

For them to do so they would either have to;

A) Hack the Mojang authentification servers, or

B) Get you to download something to your computer.

I'm guessing that B is the culprit, here. I've seen it happen before. And, like Shepherd said, if you're using a client that is NOT the Mojang-issued client, then you're open to having your information stolen.

Mash is right. There are really only a few ways to have your account compromised:

1. Something is wrong on Mojang's end (i.e. the whole migrated account hack/exploit)
2. You download something harmful (i.e. a client that steals passwords, a key logger etc.)
3. You send someone your .minecraft folder which contains your last-login information (which I'm pretty sure is the case here)
4. You join a session stealing server.
5. Your password is something incredibly stupid and easy to guess. (i.e. your password is 'password')
6. You tell someone your password.

There is no way to magically pluck a password out of thin air or steal anyone's password at whim. If that were the case, how come Mash and I aren't hacked 24/7?

I've always had the policy that account security issues are personal issues. Trust me when I say that people have been hacked before and bad stuff has happened to their faction/account. Evolve is not the first. The most I've ever done (and all I really can do) is ban the offending IP and, if an account is attached to the IP, ban the account. I'm not the FBI. I'm not going to launch a full-scale investigation.

I've heard people say I should interrogate some of the alleged factions involved. What are they going to tell me? It's not like the offending person would happily step forward. I suggest you all drop it and move on because there isn't anything more I will do. I'm sorry if this sounds harsh. Trust me, I'd love to punish who ever was responsible but I'm not about to go on a witch hunt and start banning innocent people.

Edit: What I'm perfectly fine with doing is installing a plugin like AuthMe and making it optional. Rocket and I have been working together to find one that suits our needs. This SHOULD prevent something like this happening again.

And guys, I want you all to know that's it's not that we don't want to help.

The problem, however, is that like Laser said, we're not the FBI. We cannot backtrack a proxy back to the original IP, and nobody is going to confess to this.

The only lead to anything that we have is Niner, and none of you want to press charges against him, since you're so sure he had nothing to do with it.

We cannot start punishing random factions. That's baseless and unfair, and would certainly suggest that Evolve is getting the special privileges that the rest of the server seems to think you are getting.